{"id":23797,"date":"2020-11-11T05:00:00","date_gmt":"2020-11-11T05:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/toggl.com\/blog\/?p=23797"},"modified":"2024-08-08T04:13:52","modified_gmt":"2024-08-08T04:13:52","slug":"toggl-track-ceo-interview","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/toggl.com\/blog\/toggl-track-ceo-interview","title":{"rendered":"Trust, Not Surveillance: An Interview With the Toggl Track CEO on What Sets Us Apart"},"content":{"rendered":"\n

Before Toggl\u2013the triple threat suite of productivity tools\u2013there was Toggl the timer. It was born within a software consultancy in response to a question that no other app seemed able to answer: Where was all their time going?<\/p>\n\n\n\n

More than a decade has passed since these software consultants created the timer and founded Toggl (now Toggl Track)<\/a>, but the basic premise hasn\u2019t changed. Toggl Track aims to show you how you\u2019re spending your time\u2013so you can spend it on what matters. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

But if some things have remained constant, in other ways there have been some pretty significant changes, many fairly recent. We sat down for a distanced interview with Toggl Track CEO Serge Herk\u00fcl to chat about some of these changes. But Herk\u00fcl also touched on what made Toggl Track so unique (as both a product and a company), \u201cToggling\u201d versus \u201cTracking,\u201d and his aversion to meetings.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Herk\u00fcl has a background in software and product development and has been with the Toggl group for almost a decade, joining Toggl Plan<\/a> as its first full-time frontend developer about seven years ago. Since then he\u2019s worked in a variety of product and development roles before transitioning to CEO of Toggl Plan and then coming onboard Toggl Track as CEO in April 2020. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

What are some of the challenges you\u2019ve faced as CEO of Toggl Track?<\/strong><\/h3>\n\n\n\n

Serge Herk\u00fcl<\/strong>

<\/strong>There’s a big difference in team size, coming from Toggl Plan to Toggl Track. This means the work of a CEO is also quite different. Toggl Plan has about 20 people. Toggl Track has about 86 right now. At Plan, the CEO leads the team leads. At Track, the CEO leads managers who lead team leads, so it\u2019s like an extra layer of management. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

At Toggl Track, you have no way of doing everything and being on top of everything\u2013it\u2019s just not possible. So you have to get used to this feeling of trusting others and knowing that you will never know every single thing that\u2019s going on. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

What do you find most rewarding about your role? Do you ever miss being more hands-on in the frontlines?<\/strong><\/h3>\n\n\n\n

Serge Herk\u00fcl<\/strong>

Well, I like building stuff. So it doesn\u2019t matter if it\u2019s frontend or backend or product, or building processes or growing a company\u2013it all feels kind of similar on many levels. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

I\u2019ve always been passionate about nurturing startups. So I don\u2019t necessarily miss being in frontend development, for example. But my pet peeve as CEO\u2013which is a problem I didn\u2019t have as a frontend developer\u2013is that sometimes I have way too many meetings. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

I sometimes sit from morning to evening in meetings. But other than that, I enjoy all of the many aspects of helping a company grow. I love building an awesome product, dealing with both development and design. I enjoy going through support issues and talking to customers. And I find it fulfilling to work with the revenue team on growth, with the marketing team, and putting together new teams like sales and customer success. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

What makes Toggl Track such a great product? What\u2019s the problem it\u2019s trying to solve?<\/strong><\/h3>\n\n\n\n

Serge Herk\u00fcl<\/strong>

The ultimate aim of Toggl Track is to help teams spend less time on stuff that doesn\u2019t pay, and more time on stuff that does. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

We do this by helping teams identify where their time is going. Is it being spent on a worthy cause, one that brings profit or enjoyment? Or is it being squandered on administrative duties or unprofitable side projects?<\/p>\n\n\n\n

We have our bells and whistles, but this no-fuss time tracking<\/a> is at the core of what we do. That\u2019s how we\u2019re able to accommodate a variety of different problems. Every customer has different needs, but the beauty of Toggl Track is that it\u2019s adaptable to all of these different needs. We do have companies that mostly use us for invoicing, but to really benefit from time tracking, you have to move on from the idea that it\u2019s just about showing others how you\u2019ve spent your time. It\u2019s really more about you realizing how you\u2019ve spent your time.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Individual users often use Toggl Track as a solution to inefficiency. But there\u2019s also so much room for improvement when it comes to efficiency on a team or organizational level, too.
<\/p>\n\n\n\n

Right. The more people are involved, the more efficiency decreases. But how does a time tracker help organizations become more efficient?<\/strong><\/h3>\n\n\n\n

Often the work that organizations do\u2013their projects\u2013are decided at the start of the year or at the start of the quarter. When they\u2019re carried out, there\u2019s very little insight or accountability into the work. Which project is taking how much time? How much is a project worth at the end of the day?<\/p>\n\n\n\n

You can often see this in the contracting business. Perhaps you\u2019re building something for a customer for a thousand dollars. But there are small issues. A designer is fixing this thing here and these fixes are piling up. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

One example that comes to mind is the work we did with a design agency, where we had many meetings that involved big teams. Once you start adding up the human hours, you see how adding so many people to meetings can be such a waste of time. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Tracking time is a good way to check in. With time tracking you can ask whether you should have moved on by now, or whether you should be asking for more money, or making new deals. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Only when we know how much time we spent on certain stuff can we then compare that with outcomes and know what actually mattered. Only then can we make decisions about what we should be spending less time on the next time.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

<\/p>\n\n\n\n

It\u2019s hard to talk about Toggl Track the product without discussing Toggl Track the company. Can you talk about the company culture?<\/strong><\/h3>\n\n\n\n

A key aspect of Toggl culture is trust. Toggl has always been really trusting. There\u2019s no micromanagement. There\u2019s no surveillance. I will probably get into this later but as a product, too, Toggl Track is anti-surveillance. We place a huge amount of trust in our employees, and we measure the outcomes rather than the work itself. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

What this means is that we can be remote without needing to check up on anyone. It means we can have a much more relaxed atmosphere. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

We also like to think we\u2019re pretty kind, in addition to having a chill and laid back atmosphere. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

So how do these values\u2013trust and kindness\u2013factor into the design of the Toggl Track product?<\/strong><\/h3>\n\n\n\n

In some ways, it\u2019s about what isn\u2019t <\/em>included in the product. Trust is something we take for granted in our product offering, not something we promise.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

We offer no specific features that help you survey or spy on your employees. Toggl Track is a tool that helps your team gain peak performance, not a substitute for trust. If you don\u2019t trust your team, it\u2019s not the sort of problem that software can fix for you. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

It\u2019s a discussion that you need to have with your team on how to overcome that lack of trust. I personally cannot imagine working at a company where this trust isn\u2019t the norm, where you would need to put in the extra effort to see if people were working. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

It\u2019s either you can trust your team and you get work done, or you don\u2019t trust your team and in that case, micromanaging still won\u2019t solve that problem. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Toggl is a product which is built with this dynamic of trust in mind. It works best if you trust your team. If you don\u2019t, it\u2019s not a great tool for surveilling them. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

And we have no plans at all to add surveillance features; we are very, very much an anti-surveillance product. I think we need to take a strong stance on this because many of the products in the time tracking market are surveillance-based, and a lot of anti-time tracking culture is based on the notion that time tracking is surveillance. We\u2019re about demonstrating that successful time tracking has nothing to do with surveillance. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

Final question. Post rebrand, when there are now three Toggl companies, what is a Toggler, and what is toggling? Is it a time tracker or a Toggl employee?<\/strong><\/h3>\n\n\n\n

Toggling means time tracking. Will that change, now that we have more Toggl companies? We\u2019ll see.<\/p>\n\n\n\n

And Toggler refers to both Toggl employees and Toggl users, although I am trying to make the word \u201cTrackie\u201d happen, since Toggl now refers to the entire umbrella brand. <\/p>\n\n\n\n

<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

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